Hard cranking

[antmnte]

Got a question. On my 73 Monte Carlo. 454 equipped all stock no headers. Seems when the car is hot it is hard to start sort of sounds like there is too much timing. The battery is strong I cleaned the weights on the dist so they arent sticking. I blocked the heat cross over under the carb and used a thick gasket under it as well so I dont think vapor lock but it does take long to start once it starts cranking.Something electrical? Only does it hot. Can sit in the garage for weeks and fires right up. Im stumped.

[DanStokes]

The aftermarket makes all sorts of heat shields for Chevy starters and I think this is why. You can also go to a mini-starter w/gear drive. As a get-by, you can pour any cold liquid on the starter (water, beer, etc.) and it'll crank right up. That is if you can get to it (you might need a transmission funnel). Just for fun give it a try. We had an old Ford station wagon that suffered from this and an old lady told Mom to try it and it worked!

Dan

[corvettedad]

What is the timing at idle and at 3000 rpm with all the timing advanced. Where is the ground wire grounded. Just throwing more ideas. I've got a 69 Camaro with a 454, stock manifolds, pretty good cam, crank's great. Radiator, shroud, and clutch fan are stock 427 with AC set up.

[fatguyzinc]

change the starter as noted above, or use a "start-m-up" kit
or "remote solenoid" kit. its a VERY common GM problem.

[antmnte]

Im going to address it as a heat soak problem and go from there. Its just kinda odd. It did not always do it. Kinda came out of nowhere a while back. Ground wire is on alt.bracket just as it was built. It does have a petronics unit in it but it dosent missfire or run bad.

[DanStokes]

An added thought.....I have seen them where the connection between the starter body and the block gets funky - pull the starter down and clean that area and the ground is re-established, then everything works. Another "worth a try" deal.

Dan

[Dan Barlow]

Also may try some new starter bolts as they get thinnet with usage .

[fatguyzinc]

"Im going to address it as a heat soak problem"............

change the starter as noted above, or use a "start-m-up" kit
or "remote solenoid" kit. its a VERY common GM problem.

yes, thats exactly what it is. the solenoid is binding in the housing due to excessive heat expansion.
again, VERY common on GM since the solenoid is mounted ON the starter right behind those
1200 degree manifolds/headers.

try this...........
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/s...FYFofgod4bMNbw

or just look here....

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=gm+remote+solenoid+kit&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002

[malc]

Get the original, a tad more expensive but I think you get more wire to do the job.

http://www.madelectrical.com/catalog/st-1.shtml

And if you relocate the battery to the rear...
http://www.madelectrical.com/catalog/tm-1.shtml

[anotheridiot]

I can understand your believing something else is going on since it did not happen for so long. There are some starters made on wednesdays that work well for a long time. I say made on a wednesday since who wants to work on Monday and who is thinking about work on Friday.

After the years of use it could just be worn out enough that its taking more amps to get it to engage and that means even more heat.

If you are thinking its something in the ignition, then the only way to prove it is to back off the dizzy to see if it turns. Vacuum advance, you checked if weights were sticking open, all those electronics in a pentronix might be getting hot and missing some degrees too.

99% of the time its the solenoid. If you go to a mini starter, get one you can adjust and get that turned around so the solenoid is on the bottom away from the exhaust.

[antmnte]

I want to leave it all stock. No remote solenoid. Im going to try wrapping it first. If that dosent work I will get the starter rebuilt with a new solenoid. It is a good GM rebuilt starter I was able to get years ago and I dont drive the car much but it probably on its way out now. Is it worth it to just change the solenoid? They arent much.

[Deaf Bob]

Does it crank faster once you jump it?
If so, selinoid. I have scotch brite the inner shell and cleaned the piston.. And saw improvement..
Possibly condensation. From not getting used much and hot enough to remove all moisture as it warmed up
You are right, for dollars/cents, cheper to replace.
While out, look ar the nose of the starter.. You can see (usually) the shaft and the bushing.. If it is worn, you will see it.. Bushing should be the same all around. If you are comfy removing the back plate where the brushes reside, they cn be a bear to reinstall, the brushes or that bushing may be worn

[antmnte]

Well I put a new Solenoid on it yesterday and took it for a good long drive shut it off and let it sit and it started right back up so it must of been getting ready to go. Thanks for the help everyone!

[DanStokes]

Excellent!

Dan

[PHWOARchild]

I use only high-torque starters and good solenoids, no offshore crap. On my car I use a Ford solenoid on the firewall, a throwback to my stock car days.