TUNING vs. Hard Parts vs. BOTH vs. Smog Testing.

[RockJustRock]

Thanks to people's misadventures I'm realizing a tune is about the same cost as a "classic" hop-up. Used to be the Hs. Hi Rise, Holley, Headers. Except skip the Hi Rise and Holley and do what we used to just call an Air Cleaner, The Cold Air Intake. Headers and CAI will still net a power gain even though not like the old days because stock exhaust is better. Seems like a stock tune will still keep the car running decent too. Likewise a Tune will REALLY wake a car up, but how bad could the stock tune be and how far can you go before you won't pass smog? Then if you do BOTH. How would that compare to a power adder, cheap like nitrous or expensive like boost? It all sure makes waiting until a car is old enough for a car to be inspection exempt and tearing it all off for a carb or aftermarket EFI.

I hate when I have to think so hard about a hobby...

[Monster]

The very first mods that I did to my first car was to flip the lid of the air cleaner cover over so there was a gap all around and then removed the muffler and installed a Thrush flow-thru ... ahhh, the good ole days !

[Gateclyve Photographic]

Can of worms here . . . . Even in non-CARB IM inspection states, getting more than a handful of extra horses out of a newish naturally-aspirated vehicle requires buckets more money than pre-1981 traditional hop up mods. Generally all of the hard parts are much more expensive. The gains from most bolt-ones are modest. E.O. numbers are hard to come by.

Nitrous oxide is still the cheapest, simplest, and quickest way to make big gains on late-model iron. Few if any "tunes"using all stock parts have the raw power and torque potential of the bottle. But squeeze has limited utility, inconvenience, relatively high costs for bottle refills, and questionable legality and safety on the street.

A "tune" operates in a grayer and more easily concealable zone.

Other than nitrous, supercharging and turbocharging are the home run plays for late models. $7,000 on traditional "all motor" engine work will almost always be hammered by bolt-on forced induction.-- and usually without the drivability and emission compliance penalties of similar naturally aspirated power. The future on the street belongs to forced induction.

These are just thoughts of one man who has modified a few emissions-controlled "computer" cars over the past three decades.

[pdub]

The very first mods that I did to my first car was to flip the lid of the air cleaner cover over so there was a gap all around and then removed the muffler and installed a Thrush flow-thru ... ahhh, the good ole days !

Those Thrush mufflers were great for about a week until all the stuffing blew out of them. I think a week is about as long as they would last.

[SuperBuickGuy]

in June of 2019, the State of Washington will no longer test vehicle emissions. There is already a rolling 25 year exception but now they're 'admitting' that smog testing is costly for no real benefit.... so in June, they close all the test centers. I cannot wait.

And yeah, it's a 'liberal' state - and you all wonder why I'm so adamant about a wall between Oregon and Washington.... I figure once the libs see this there will be a great cry of anguish

[Monster]

Thrush mufflers were great for about a week until all the stuffing blew out of them.

Thrush mufflers sucked for a week, until all the stuffing blew out of them.

[Gateclyve Photographic]

in June of 2019, the State of Washington will no longer test vehicle emissions. There is already a rolling 25 year exception but now they're 'admitting' that smog testing is costly for no real benefit.... so in June, they close all the test centers. I cannot wait.

And yeah, it's a 'liberal' state - and you all wonder why I'm so adamant about a wall between Oregon and Washington.... I figure once the libs see this there will be a great cry of anguish

How can anyone "see" anything through all of the reefer smoke . . . .

[RockJustRock]

in June of 2019, the State of Washington will no longer test vehicle emissions. There is already a rolling 25 year exception but now they're 'admitting' that smog testing is costly for no real benefit.... so in June, they close all the test centers. I cannot wait.

And yeah, it's a 'liberal' state - and you all wonder why I'm so adamant about a wall between Oregon and Washington.... I figure once the libs see this there will be a great cry of anguish

Fewer and fewer even DRIVE, to say nothing to trying to enjoy it. Many states were slow to start testing (Maybe they even still don't, I don't live everywhere.) in the 80s Wisconsin didn't, Arizona did. I was really stupid and sold my last fast car in Arizona because I ASSUMED California would be stricter. Arizona was state-run. When I got here California was privatized and $200 would get a Pro Stock smogged (SOCIALISTS!).

[RockJustRock]

How can anyone "see" anything through all of the reefer smoke . . . .

Tasteful and subtle as always, hater....

[RockJustRock]

Thrush mufflers sucked for a week, until all the stuffing blew out of them.

My thread, my derail....

Isn't it funny how the first TRUE high performance mufflers were the Corvair Turbo, The Chrysler Hemi Muffler and the Ford..... oh nevermind!

[RockJustRock]

I still see headers as the bargain. A pain to install, but it changes the whole personality of the car, relatively cheap. The wear used to be a factor but stainless seems to be getting cheaper. Plus the aftermarket saw that to offset SUCKY with perfect wasn't always the best product and made short tube non equal length easier install headers. For me nothing say hot rod more than jacking the car up uncorking it and bolting up the slicks. Makes my pants fit funny thinking about it.

Not throwing stones but spending thousands on tuning stuff and keeping your hands clean and you get HOW MUCH power? 10%, 20%?

If I had a newer car I'd go with drag radials and beadlocks on the street. New Fad, Pro Small Tire!

[Monster]

Performance improvements have an exponential curve with cost versus benefit .. there is the low hanging fruit that nets huge gains inexpensively, up to the other extreme of paying big bucks for that last little 5%.

[pdub]

Performance improvements have an exponential curve with cost versus benefit .. there is the low hanging fruit that nets huge gains inexpensively, up to the other extreme of paying big bucks for that last little 5%.

So true Steve. I've got a cookie-cutter Mustang, something nobody wants, but those cars respond very well to bolt-ons. And I've bolted everything onto it that anybody can ever bolt onto it and I still get my butt whipped on road courses. And I don't mean driver skill. Red handles great on the straightaway when he's getting passed by a Volkwagen hatchback.

Land speed. Don't tell the road course guys, we don't want them to know about that land speed thing. I've got too much money tied up into the setup already.

[RockJustRock]

Headers Pee Wee. Ever owned a car with headers? Go find a Mustang with headers, listen to it and think about it. Worth paying someone else to put them on too. Curious.... does Superman have headers? I kinda doubt it. Aside from the side mounts headers aren't really a Corvette thing. Too bad more body styles didn't get just associated with sidemount headers. The world would be a better place. I bet if you made sidemount headers for an LS powered Mustang, any recent Mustang actually, you'd sell a BUNCH. No place for a catalytic converter though.

[nickleone]

Headers, Both my 2 liter Pintos had headers plus 2 single barrel carbs.
Now my 90 Mustang a 2.3 liter engine will be left unmolested we have clean air testing

Nick