Tedly's Bluebird

[tedly]

Finally getting started on the TBird after a delay. Quick pick of right after I got it.


Officially retired it Tuesday and with help from my buddy Chris, we mostly gutted the interior. I'm leaving the dash, wiring, and glass in for the moment so it can be moved in and out of the garage under its own power and be left outside for a bit while I work on other things in the garage.

[tedly]

Got a nice little surprise when I uncovered the shock towers.


I knew they were rusting, but I didn't know they were that bad. I had wanted to keep the IRS, but now am seriously considering mini-tubs and a solid axle. Going to check into all the options and figure out what direction I'm going to go with it.

[BBR]

What's the plan for it?!?!?!?

[hauen]

Luckily the IRS is completely separate from the unibody on those, the shock towers are just that, you could probably just patch those up and be okay.

[tedly]

What's the plan for it?!?!?!?

Right now it's a 3.8 six & 4R70W auto. Plan is to get rid of all the friggin rust, stuff a 400 hp naturally aspirated 4.6 DOHC, stick (still debating which one), 8.8 rear with a 4:11, roll cage, upgrade the suspension, drop it a couple inches, chrome 18'' Cobra R wheels, cowl hood to clear the 4.6, then drive the hell out of it when it's done and race every opportunity I get.

[BBR]

Yeeeeeeesssssssss.

[tedly]

Luckily the IRS is completely separate from the unibody on those, the shock towers are just that, you could probably just patch those up and be okay.

I hope so, but part of me still wants to tub it!

[tedly]

Yeeeeeeesssssssss.

Don't have the engine specs I'm shooting for here, they're at work at the moment. Basically I'm going to be following a recipe for 400 hp that Sean Hyland cooked up. I'm wanting the early version of the 4.6 with the dual intake runners on the manifold so I can get better low end torque. She's a heavy girl and can use a little help down low. These engines have thin cylinder walls that don't tolerate much over-bore and stroking them seems to open up a whole new can of worms so displacement will stay about the same. I've seen a lot of problems with power adders on a stock bottom end so to circumvent that and keep cost under control I'm just going to stick with NA for now, maybe build an engine with forced induction in mind later on. Since there's no blower or nitrous I can stick with hypereutectic pistons and maybe bump up the compression a bit, this will help keep the cost down and the lighter pistons might allow some more rpms. Don't remember the cam specs Hyland recommends, but the info is a couple of years old so I'm looking into the options available today. TBirds didn't come with the DOHC but they did have the SOHC, the engine wiring harness is very close and with just a little lengthening here and there works just fine. The Mark VIII had the DOHC and is built off the same platform but the computer is located on the drivers side on the Mark and passenger side on the Birds. Much easier to just use the TBird wiring harness from what I understand. There are no headers made for this particular swap that I'm aware of so it looks like I'll be making my own. Fun, especially when you consider how tight the DOHC is going to be in my engine compartment (about an inch clearance on either side if I remember right). The MN12 platform came with manual trans that had hydraulic clutches, making a non hydraulic clutch trans work is supposed to be a real bitch. I've only found a handfull of people who have done it. I'd like a T56 for the double overdrive since I plan on taking the Bird on road trips but may have to stick with a 5 speed to simplify it some. Still looking into driveshafts and if I'll have to shorten one or can get away with a stock, that's going to mostly depend on what trans I use. The rear end in the Bird now is pretty damn wimpy, the half shafts are barely bigger around than a standard Craftsman 3/8 drive ratchet so I'm going to get an 8.8 IRS from a Mark VIII and put it in. The DOHC motors love to rev and generally don't come alive until higher in the rpm range so a 4.10 gear should keep it and me happy. There's a simple swap for putting slightly larger front brakes from a similar vintage Mustang on, these cars are notorious for chewing up rotors because the brakes are too small for the heft. Again, keeping costs in line verses putting in an aftermarket brake system. Wheel choices are limited because of the odd lug spacing so a switch to Mustang hubs might be in order.

God knows what else I'm forgetting, this is just off the top of my head. I've got my work cut out for me for sure. First and foremost is to finish stripping it down and find out how bad the rust is and how much time and money have to be dedicated to fixing it. The rest will follow from there.

[hauen]

Another manual transmission option would be to source an M5R2 out of a post '97 Ford truck, it has a pretty deep first gear (3.75) to get you going, hydraulic clutch, just like an MN-12 bird. In fact, the RKE out of super coupes is for all intents and purposes an M5R2. At least from what I can see on the rebuilder sites. I was thinking of going this route with Ernie until a T-45 popped up at a price I couldn't refuse.

[tedly]

Those are both leading candidates for the trans swap.

The M5R2's came in the Thunderbird SC's and the Cougar versions. Can't remember if the 6 cylinder bellhousing bolt patterns are different from the 4.6. Still looking into the details, like what the difference is between the truck and SC internals. One advantage this trans has is that it was originally offered in my body style. The shifter has to sit further back on the trans or it will come through the floorboard right under the radio, there are ready made parts for this with the M5R2, just got to locate them.

The T45 out of 96 and up 4.6 Mustangs is a popular swap for the Thunderbirds and there's a good amount of info available on it. This is looking like the easiest one to find and get parts for, but I'll just have to see what's available and how much it costs when the time comes.

[Beagle]

3.8 and SBF have the same bellhousing pattern iirc.

[tedly]

If anyone else is crazy enough to consider doing this, here are some resources that have proven very valuable in my research. As I find more I'll update the list.

TCCOA, The Thunderbird and Cougar Club Of America. Their site and forums are filled with just about any info you need for late model Thunderbirds, Cougars, and Mark VIII's.

How to Build Max Performance 4.6 Liter Ford Engines by Sean Hyland. Lots of useful information on 4.6 engines and what needs to be done to get it to live at different power levels.

[tedly]

3.8 and SBF have the same bellhousing pattern iirc.

The NA 3.8 and the supercharged 3.8 have different patterns though.

EDIT: I'm going to re-check this when I'm not falling asleep at my computer, very possible I got info crossed up here.

[RustyRodder]

The NA 3.8 and the supercharged 3.8 have different patterns though.

EDIT: I'm going to re-check this when I'm not falling asleep at my computer, very possible I got info crossed up here.

Nerp, same patter/block. only difference was the SC's had forged rods

[tedly]

See my sig line below. Not sure what my brain was cross referencing but thanks for calling me on it.

Got an engine hoist lined up, not gonna get to it this week, lining it up for next week.