WTH, People? Shooting in Denver

[bishir]

I was wondering this too, this is his neck of the woods, correct??


I wonder how many situations like this would be different if the "attacker" knew EVERY capable person in the room, would return fire??

just thinking out loud... nothing more, nothing less. sorry for their losses.

Agreed, there is a reason this doesn't happen at police stations, NRA conventions, or turkey shoots. I find it mind boggling anyone capable of performing these acts would be deterred by access to resources or laws. To quote a cliche' "where there is a will there is a way."

[tedly]

Can't go with you on the "inherent goodness" point but I cannot explain without violation of the forum rules.

I can only offer this as a rebuttal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liviu_Librescu

[38P]

I know to which you refer (point well taken) and I never ment to imply the source is internal. My point being that it's not a stretch to confer there is a moral authority of good if you also believe there is such a thing as evil.

I'm with ya.

Just read this:

"Federal law enforcement sources tell ABC News that Holmes bought a ticket to the movie, slipped out of the theater once it began and propped open the emergency exit before gathering his weapons and gear and coming back into the theater. Once inside, he opened fire."

I wouldn't want to be the movie theater operator (which I think I saw somewhere was AMC?) trying to explain why emergency exits don't have alarms and aren't monitored by security. (I know why -- the exits are routinely used at the end of films and it costs too much). This one may be a bonanza for the trial lawyers . . . .

[38P]

I can only offer this as a rebuttal.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liviu_Librescu

Heroic action, for sure.

[pdub]

Well, it's another dark day that will play on all of us, even this far (on the map) away from it.

So many emotions and opinions that everyone wants to express about it, and that's a natural thing. And a good thing, part of the coping process, I just SO feel for the victims, their families, and all the survivors in that building when that happened. Naturally, their perspective on life will be forever damaged unless they choose to just not dwell on it.

I may have said here on the board before in practically the same words, if I did....well, you take a long-shot photo of any busy intersection, and if you KNEW, you could draw an arrow to at least one of the people in all of those vehicles and draw a huge arrow and label it HERE'S A DANGEROUS NUTCASE. Undocumented, but here's a nutcase, amongst us.

And so many great feelings and opinions stated above, I can't add any to that from my vocabulary. To repeat what's been said in overlapping posts, it's the press, the immediate and sensational coverage of it that makes us all feel like it happened mighty close to where we live.

So, are we now afraid to go to a movie? If we are, we're physical victims, too.

And not to join the fray in this way, I don't want to, but when was it...earlier this week or last week?.. that somebody shot up a bar in Alabama. A lesser story in the news because it wasn't on such a grand scale as today's event. We were talking about that incident at work and I can't believe what came out of my mouth - "If that had been in Tennessee, he'da never got off that many shots."

Because NEARLY everybody's packing here. Not everybody, so you don't know who's not. I hate guns, wish nobody had one, wish nobody felt like they HAVE to have one. But I'm aging my way into the belief that concealed carry licenses are a good thing.

Only because the bad guys can get guns, too.

[38P]

PDub,
Regardless of how bad this is, we cannot live in fear. I had to decide this the first time I boarded an airliner little more than one month after 9/11. On an airliner, you're completely vulnerable.

Some say our days are numbered before we're born. Irregardless, the best we can hope for is that our reasonable precautions and situational awareness (and Divine providence for those of us who are so wired) will be sufficient for us to cope with whatever comes our way.

I mean everytime you're stopped at a traffic light, a drunk, nutjob, inattentive texter, criminal, or cardiac victim could plow into the back of you and kill you. Everytime we go onto a race track, we put ourselves at the mercy of countless others, from the unknown Chinese dude who signed off on our brake rotors, to our fellow competitors, to the corner workers (road course) or starter (at the strip). Virtually everything in life involves reliance on the acts of others to insure our safety.

Fear is paralyzing. So we respect and plan for the worst and hope for the best. The best is that there was no massacre at 10,000 other movie theaters last night. And there won't be one tonight. Or tomorrow.

[BBR]

I am all for people carrying guns, but this dude had the drop on everybody. Dark room, smoke, bright screen to his back. He could see everything and you would be able to see next to nothing. Your chance of getting your CCW out and popping him would be slim to none in the chaos.

[skullbucket]

I firmly believe TV and rap music cause all of this.
You could blame it on the "carnys" that travel from town to town with the circus but..........................
Im so sick of no matter what channel you turn to all they do is cuss, R rated sex, gay, killings and perverted situations.
It sux to sit down with the family to watch TV and WAMMO, rape and murder on every channel unless you watch the church channel and all they want is donations!
And don't say turn off the TV, and do what? dust the furniture 7 nights a week, I should be able to watch TV without smut.

Your chance of getting your CCW out and popping him would be slim to none in the chaos.

And this is right also, you have 1 target and he has 100.

[pdub]

It goes on. According to the news (y'all know how I hate the news coverage), all day today Warner Bros. is considering pulling back from the screening of the movie because if it. Like flawed news coverage is, does that mean the movie will never play again or WHAT? Dadgum I hate the media. For a long time today they had the killer's car having Tennessee plates on it. This evening they had the professional strength to say that was wrong. So what else is wrong? We only know something real bad happened.

But from the Warner Bros' perspective....now that this has happened, how many millions of people would go to watch the movie and know that when the shootout scene started (whatever it is), ...that's when the REAL shooting started? And play on people's minds?

Gosh, whatta mess. Initiated by one sole person on this earth. Don't lose sight of the fact that one single person did this.

[38P]

I am all for people carrying guns, but this dude had the drop on everybody. Dark room, smoke, bright screen to his back. He could see everything and you would be able to see next to nothing. Your chance of getting your CCW out and popping him would be slim to none in the chaos.

Taking the bait . . .

Maybe, maybe not. With proper tactical training, I'd be willing to bet this guy could be outflanked while he's focused on other targets (he was a freakin PhD student, not a professsional). And given how most modern stadium seating theaters are arranged, his field of fire probably couldn't cover the whole thing at once.

Still, the real prevention is stopping the perp/terrorist from waltzing back in through the emergency exit unabated with his ninja getup and weapons on. That's the choke point.

[pdub]

Taking the bait . . .

Maybe, maybe not. With proper tactical training, I'd be willing to bet this guy could be outflanked while he's focused on other targets (he was a freakin PhD student, not a professsional). And given how most modern stadium seating theaters are arranged, his field of fire probably couldn't cover the whole thing at once.

Still, the real prevention is stopping the perp/terrorist from waltzing back in through the emergency exit unabated with his ninja getup and weapons on. That's the choke point.

I'll take the bait-bait again - can anybody pack in the Denver area? I ask because I don't know. Dude was killing people who were holding cell phones.

[38P]

It goes on. According to the news (y'all know how I hate the news coverage), all day today Warner Bros. is considering pulling back from the screening of the movie because if it. .

PDub, that might be a smart business decision to delay release for a while. Respects the grieving. Gives the frightened time to calm down (this might hurt "BO" gross because some will be too frightened to go to the movies this weekend) Allows the film to stand on its own merit instead of the spectacle.

[38P]

Requirements:
1. Colorado resident
2. Age 21 or older
3. Not precluded by state or federal law from owning or possessing a firearm (e.g. felony conviction, mentally incompetent)
4. Does not chronically or habitually abuse alcohol
5. Is not an unlawful user of or addicted to controlled substances
6. Is not the subject of a civil or criminal restraining order
7. Complete background check, including fingerprint verification by FBI/CBI
8. Demonstrates competence with a handgun by one of the following means:
a. evidence of experience with a firearm through participation in organized shooting competitions or current military service
b. certified firearms instructor
c. honorable discharge from the Armed Forces within past three years
d. proof of pistol qualification in Armed Forces within past ten years, if discharged
e. retired law enforcement with pistol qualification within past ten years
f. proof of completion of a handgun training class within the past ten years


Most likely the crime scene was a posted "no concealed carry" establishment . . . a so-called "soft target." So packin' would likely have been violation of the law.

[pdub]

Soft target indeed. That makes it even sicker. Thanks for the info Speedz.

[skullbucket]

Taking the bait . . .

Maybe, maybe not. With proper tactical training, I'd be willing to bet this guy could be outflanked while he's focused on other targets (he was a freakin PhD student, not a professsional).

OMG you got to be kidding!
The guy wasnt aiming at anyone, he was spraying and praying he hit as many as he could.
There would have been a better chance of a football player tackling him than someone aiming at a silhouette and hoping it was the shooter.
Like I said he had a 100 targets and a defender had 1, whos got the better chance of a kill?
I wouldn't have took a shot if I was standing right next to him because when they found your bullit in a little kids head, your going to the pokey.