Which EFI controller?

[TheSilverBuick]

Randal - that also didn't happen with EFI.... but now I'm wondering how EFI would have handled it. It was an intermittent ping. Only happened when boost was higher that 6 psi, but not at WOT.

It would likely happen the same if it was a result of bad fuel. EFI doesn't correct for the quality of the fuel (though there are sensors for E85 that will adjust for the ethanol, but other than that). I still haven't made a serious go at getting my knock sensor hooked up since I replaced the sensor on the last re-build, but I was getting better voltage readings from it when I checked it with a voltmeter. A working knock sensor may of helped if enough timing could be pulled.

[SuperBuickGuy]

what is the time-frame on availability of the MS3? I plan on both the Spider and Buick running by May. The Spider is actually going to run, then be sent down to Cali for some paint n body work; that moment isn't too far away since the last of the hard(ish) fab work is putting the rear end in it.

post mortem on that block - I think an intake gasket was leaking under boost - but only the middle, and only when fully warm... with port-efi, I don't think I would have had that problem - it would have run rich.... of course, with the blower, that wouldn't have been an easy thing to do.

[dieselgeek]

MS3 is ready to go - minimal assembly required if you get it from DIYautotune.com... a hardened version is probably a year out still.

[SuperBuickGuy]

I'm kind of focusing on MS2. - the year out, it'd be an upgrade. I'm waiting for the machine shop to finish the block, I'll get the laser cut pieces by Friday, the exhaust will be done end of January, intake a couple weeks after that.... in the car by end of April...


the only project I have that languishes is my Caddy powered Studebaker truck (20+ years of languish).... the rest get done, driven, broken, fixed then driven again.

[TC]

CarCraft did a sub article in one of their articles in the latest CC, that has a MS3 setup coming in at over $2200, that price includes the unit, the two Bosch control boxes you need for the ignition, a LM1 wide band O2 meter, and a day at the dyno for tuning..........

[Bob Holmes]

Get the MS, get a JimStim, download the software for EFI analytics and start playing with it.

[TheSilverBuick]

CarCraft did a sub article in one of their articles in the latest CC, that has a MS3 setup coming in at over $2200, that price includes the unit, the two Bosch control boxes you need for the ignition, a LM1 wide band O2 meter, and a day at the dyno for tuning..........

Did you notice on those articles that BBK here was the throttle body supplier? Didn't list a price though, but I figured that was okay because TB's is a big variable that can be as expensive or as cheap as your innovation and fabrications, plus it was a fixed cost associated with all the set ups.

D/G, do you know the reasoning for needing the two Bosch boxes? Is that so it's sequentially sparked too instead of a wasted spark? The Turbo Buick's were wasted sparked, so I don't see a problem with wasted spark and boost (or NA).

[dieselgeek]

D/G, do you know the reasoning for needing the two Bosch boxes? Is that so it's sequentially sparked too instead of a wasted spark? The Turbo Buick's were wasted sparked, so I don't see a problem with wasted spark and boost (or NA).

Is the article online? I don't get CC anymore. I can go grab the current article over lunch though... usually the only "Bosch Boxes" that would be needed would be an Ignition transistor. Buying them from Bosch is pretty stupid (they're crazy expensive for what they do) - best bet is to get one that either DIY Autotune makes, or the one that EFI SOurce makes (CDMBill has run this for a couple years).

I.e., you don't need the "Bosch Boxes" for anything if you know what you're doing or do a little homework.

[CDMBill]

The EFI Source box I have is usually known as an igniter, basically a current step up device to drive coils that don't have igniters built in like the one per cylinder GM LS or Pantera EFI IGN coils have built in. I'm using two four tower Pantera EFI coils in a wasted spark set-up that needs just the one box. They retail for $90. http://www.efisource.com/ Its been bullet proof since 2007 despite slightly melting the case when I mounted it with the coils on top of the manifold. Now its inside the car with the EMS-Pro box. (An OEM quality version of the MSII) also available from EFI Source

[SuperBuickGuy]

if I read the above correct - that means you don't need the ignitor or the Bosch with the MS2 or MS3 when you use LS2 coils?

[Bob Holmes]

We didn't use an ignitor on our LSx coils and the MSIII. LSx coils are "self-ignitors."

[dieselgeek]

if I read the above correct - that means you don't need the ignitor or the Bosch with the MS2 or MS3 when you use LS2 coils?

You won't need an ignitor or "Bosch Box" (lol) with ANY of the MS variants when you run an LS coilpack, this is because the ignitor is built into the LS pack. It's nice, it keeps noise out of your EMS box. We ran them at Engine Masters and they're golden IMO.

However, if you're running the MS2, you have to run them "wasted spark" only because the MS1 and MS2 (the EMS-pro is an *MS1, not MS2*) don't have 8 dedicated spark outputs. I prefer to run the LS coils sequentially but plenty of people DO run them wasted spark with no prob. To run them sequentially, like the fuel, you'd need the MS3.

[TC]

This is what the article says about the Bosch boxes...."The MS330 controls the ignition timing but is designed to work through a control module that amplifies the spark. The company recommends a pair of four cylinder Bosch control boxes that cost about $180 each".

Now this could be different for different makes, but remember they are dealing with a 5.7 Hemi motor........

Oh and the article is comparing different options from using the factory stuff to different aftermarket EFI setups, and ever the carb version was thrown in......

[Stich496]

will a msII run 8 hei coils?? thinking low budget.. like junkyard low..
hell will it fire 8 old oil filled coils for a ole school look

[Bob Holmes]

Remember that the metric hemi runs 2 plugs per hole.

If you need to run wasted spark, I'd suggest using a coil setup that was designed for wasted spark. YMMV.